Why Im glad gas prices are going up.

I know it souns strange, but Im glad gas prices are going up.
Yes, I know the rising prices are putting money into the pockets of huge corporations. I know that goods are going to go up due to the impact of fuel prices on distrobution.
But, I know that its actually a good thing.
Fuel is never going to go back down to the $1.20 I can remember just a few years ago. With the prices maybe going to someday regulate themselves into the $1.50, $1.60 range at best in a few months, its still going to be pricey.
With higher prices like that, there are going to be positive changes.
Hybrid cars are already showing a 30% increase in sales. As they sell more, their prices are going to drop as they continue to be sold and become more widespread. Thier technology is going to get better, and therefore more fuel efficent than they already are. As they become more common, repair and maintenance is going to become cheaper. Therefore in the next few years, hybrid cars are going to become more common, and not the domain of "eco-geeks". With the increase of the use of Hybrid cars, ecological inpact from petroleum use will decline, I forsee a cleaner sky for Los Angeles, Dallas, and other smog ridden cities.
Perhaps Hybrid SUV's, buses, and Semi's will be the wave of the future?
SUV's and Supertrucks will become scarcer. The huge bohemoths of American consumer culture will loose their apeal. At 12 MPG consumption, its already easy to spend well over 50 bucks to refill the tank. Yes, those that can afford it will continue to spend that much, but, those that cant will sell their cars off, or trade them in for a more fuel practical car. No point in having a quarter tank of gas in your new e-class and being broke just to put that much in there. Economy cars and sedans will become sportier and more appealing than before due to the practical nature of the cost.
Engines will become efficent. As consumer demand increases for efficent engines, manufacturers will need to build them. With Japanese cars already leading the market, American manufacturers will have to become innovative again to compete. I forsee cars getting 35 maybe 40 MPG on the highway in the next few years.
Increase in carpooling, bicycleing, and public transportation will come about. People will group together to get to work and pool their money to share the ride. Why spend 20 bucks a week for gas when you and three buddies can throw in 5? Besides youre all going to the same place. Cities that lack a quality public transportation system will develop them into a fully functional system, that lessens the impact on the environment and city road systems. Why pay 30 bucks a week to get to work when you can get a bus pass for a month for the same price? Those that live near work, and dont have to worry about thier $1000 dollar suits, will ride a bike to work. This will of course lessen the impact on pollution, congestion, and thier own health problems.

See, folks, maybe higher gas prices arent a bad thing....

[Dionysos]

This is essentially what happened in the 70s after the gas crunch by OPEC. Things eventually regressed, but instead of muscle cars this time it was SUVs. The one major difference are the hybrid cars available now. One would hope these keep taking off in popularity. My dad knows a man that owns a Toyota dealership, right now they can't keep the Prius in stock. You can buy one right now and take it off the lot if you want to pay a $3000-5000 premium, otherwise it's 8-12 weeks wait.

Whatever it takes to wean America off imported oil.

[Krash]

Damn right, and people thought Saudi was increasing output to help out the west, pffft - they're afraid we'll go cold turkey and they'll be unable to push their crack on us anymore.

[johnny861]

Originally posted by Krash
Damn right, and people thought Saudi was increasing output to help out the west, pffft - they're afraid we'll go cold turkey and they'll be unable to push their crack on us anymore.

Actually, I heard many Rifineries are starting to reach capacity...



But overall, I agree... It's time we start to push ourselves off dead plants and dinos and on to something with more of a modern feel to it...

But for the meantime, I've been eyeing that new Civic Hybrid that's out.... very nice looking...

[Satchel]

I read the other day something about it taking 12 years to recoup the extra cost from the gas savings on hybrids. I don't see how that will be a practical solution unless the government starts rolling out the tax credits. Maybe Kerry will repeal Bush's SUV break and give it to the hybrids.

[johnny861]

Originally posted by Satchel
I read the other day something about it taking 12 years to recoup the extra cost from the gas savings on hybrids. I don't see how that will be a practical solution unless the government starts rolling out the tax credits. Maybe Kerry will repeal Bush's SUV break and give it to the hybrids.

Actually, you can get tax credits for alternative fuel vehicles, but I dunno if Hybrids are included in that...

[Dionysos]

Originally posted by Satchel
I read the other day something about it taking 12 years to recoup the extra cost from the gas savings on hybrids. I don't see how that will be a practical solution unless the government starts rolling out the tax credits. Maybe Kerry will repeal Bush's SUV break and give it to the hybrids.

Well, here's the math. Using a new Hybrid Civic against a regular Civic and comparing the base models on each, the difference in price(excluding taxes, etc.) is about $6500. The regular Civic gets 32/38mpg, the Hybrid gets 46/51 for an average difference of 14mpg. If a person drives 15,000 miles a year(not that much, especially for a D/FW commute), that's a savings of 100-140 gallons a year. Essentially your savings per year is ~$200-300 a year on gas, so it could recoup itself over the course of about 15 years. What this fails to take into account is any differences in maintenance, mechanical wear & tear, etc. That could easily swing this a couple thousand either way, so it's hard to say if it's going to be cheaper in the long run or not.


On a larger scale, if you want to look at America and the effects of switching to hybrids we can look at it this way. There are an estimated 204 million cars in America as of 2003. For the sake of easy math we will say they all drive standard base model Civics. All other variables being equal(i.e. no rise or fall in other forms of oil consumption) if we got 1% of those cars switched to Hybrid Civics, it would save ~200 million gallons of gas consumption a year. About 19.5 gallons of the ~44 gallons from each barrel of oil become gas for our cars(the rest is used elsewhere), so we're talking about a yearly reduction of ~4.6 million barrels of oil. To put that in perspective, that would be like telling Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, & Canada to shut off their pumps to us for 1 day a year. As you can see, it's going to take a far bigger effort than 1%.

If we were able to take all the SUVs in America(about 17.5 million) and convert them to the Hybrid Civics, then we're talking about a yearly reduction of ~35 million barrels of oil. That's like telling Saudi Arabia to shove it for a month a year, or telling the 3 I mentioned previously to take a 10 day vacation. It's not enough imo, but it's better than nothing.

I think I just depressed myself.

note: I've rounded a few of these numbers to make them more presentable and the number I used for SUVs is an extrapolation of data I saw dating from 1997, so these numbers aren't exact. However they should give you an idea of the scope of the issue.

[[aNNa]]

isn't gas like.. $6.00+(U.S.) a gallon in england
and $5.00+ (U.S.) a gallon in sweden, for example?

or something like that..
if so why is that the case?

also, doesn't that make us look like a bunch
of wussy whiners? (just wondering)

[KiloWatts]

On the other hand, America really needs a massive public interstate train system.

[Dionysos]

Originally posted by [aNNa]
isn't gas like.. $6.00+(U.S.) a gallon in england
and $5.00+ (U.S.) a gallon in sweden, for example?

or something like that..
if so why is that the case?

also, doesn't that make us look like a bunch
of wussy whiners? (just wondering)

Because theirs is much more heavily taxed. England's gas price is 2/3 to 3/4 tax. If you wipe out the taxes, they get gas for roughly the same price as we do. I want to say England's current gas price in USD without tax is something like $2.30/gallon, depending on the exchange rate.

[Krash]

Originally posted by Dionysos
Because theirs is much more heavily taxed. England's gas price is 2/3 to 3/4 tax. If you wipe out the taxes, they get gas for roughly the same price as we do. I want to say England's current gas price in USD without tax is something like $2.30/gallon, depending on the exchange rate.

Due to our oil supplies from the North Sea, our fuel is actually the cheapest in the world. But yes, about 3/4 of our cost is tax.

[Adam D]

For somebody like me who puts a lot of mileage on my car, I would recoup the difference in price a lot quicker than 15 years. And if gas prices keep rising, then it would be even quicker.

I would also imagine that since it's new technology the value of the car over time is going to stay higher at trade-in time than a normal civic which depreciate a lot simply because of how many of them are on the road.

the collective effect is more than just oil consumption. its also more efficient cars that produce less emissions.
there is also the idea of alternative fuel cars. there would be more interest in fuel cell, hydrogen, and natural gas cars. sure they may not be practical at this time, but that wont stop people from trying will it?
the other effect is more public transportation. it will become cheaper to ride a bus, carpool, and take a subway. for places that lack a train, or adequate bus system, consumer interest will expand the system. Lots of places could easily benifit from a subway system. Think of how great it would be to take a subway from your house in Denton or Plano to Deep Ellum to go party and skip out on the insane drive.
The less cars on the road (cause people will only really drive if its worth it as gas prices stay high) means less strain on the road system. Less construction and repair means those taxes can be used on better civic services such as schools, and other public works.
Also, people might be more willing to walk the two blocks to the gas station for smokes and a soda, or ride thier bike to work when the weather is nice.

The benifits are more than dependance on foriegn oil.

[psyon]

I don't care if the prices go up to 10$ a gallon, I'll just luagh and ride my bike.

[Hey Bubu]

Neat article on Hybrids

http://motortrend.com/features/news/112_news46/