did they say historical fact?

[bushsucks]

Read "The Millions That Could Have Been Saved" by I.Domb
It is an historical fact that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered all European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their property in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that: a) none of the deportees travel from Spain to Palestine; and http://www.michiganravers.com/forums...fault/cool.gif all the deportees be transported from Spain to the USA or British colonies, and there to remain; with entry visas to be arranged by the Jews living there; and c) $1000.00 ransom for each family to be furnished by the Agency, payable upon the arrival of the family at the Spanish border at the rate of 1000 families daily.

The Zionist leaders in Switzerland and Turkey received this offer with the clear understanding that the exclusion of Palestine as a destination for the deportees was based on an agreement between the Gestapo and the Mufti.

The answer of the Zionist leaders was negative, with the following comments: a) ONLY Palestine would be considered as a destination for the deportees. http://www.michiganravers.com/forums...fault/cool.gif The European Jews must accede to suffering and death greater in measure than the other nations, in order that the victorious allies agree to a "Jewish State" at the end of the war. c) No ransom will be paid This response to the Gestapo's offer was made with the full knowledge that the alternative to this offer was the gas chamber.

These treacherous Zionist leaders betrayed their own flesh and blood. Zionism was never an option for Jewish salvation. Quite the opposite, it was a formula for human beings to be used as pawns for the power trip of several desperadoes. A perfidy! A betrayal beyond description!

In 1944, at the time of the Hungarian deportations, a similar offer was made, whereby all Hungarian Jewry could be saved. The same Zionist hierarchy again refused this offer (after the gas chambers had already taken a toll of millions).

The British government granted visas to 300 rabbis and their families to the Colony of Mauritius, with passage for the evacuees through Turkey. The "Jewish Agency" leaders sabotaged this plan with the observation that the plan was disloyal to Palestine, and the 300 rabbis and their families should be gassed.

On December 17, 1942 both houses of the British Parliament declared its readiness to find temporary refuge for endangered persons. The British Parliament proposed to evacuate 500,000 Jews from Europe, and resettle them in British colonies, as a part of diplomatic negotiations with Germany. This motion received within two weeks a total of 277 Parliamentary signatures. On Jan. 27, when the next steps were being pursued by over 100 M.P.'s and Lords, a spokesman for the Zionists announced that the Jews would oppose the motion because Palestine was omitted. [Source]

On Feb. 16, 1943 Roumania offered 70,000 Jewish refugees of the Trans-Dniestria to leave at the cost of $50 each. This was publicized in the New York papers. Yitzhak Greenbaum, Chairman of the Rescue Committee of the Jewish Agency, addressing the Zionist Executive Council in Tel Aviv Feb. 18 1943 said, "when they asked me, "couldn't you give money out of the United Jewish Appeal funds for the rescue of Jews in Europe, I said NO! and I say again, NO!...one should resist this wave which pushes the Zionist activities to secondary importance." On Feb. 24, 1943 Stephen Wise, President of the American Jewish Congress and leader of the American Zionists issued a public refusal to this offer and declared no collection of funds would seem justified. In 1944, the Emergency Committee to Save the Jewish People called upon the American government to establish a War Refugee Board. Stephen Wise testifying before a special committee of Congress objected to this proposal. [Source]

[Coyotl]

this is intruiging. but is it true?

[Edwin Watson]

it is a mixture of truth and fiction. there were offers here and there early in the war to deport the jews. many of the jews living in europe refused because that is where they were from. The vast majority of the jews were living in ghetto's in the major cities and were walled into these neighborhoods. the camps that were in existence at this time were work camps, not death camps (there may have been an exception or two, but even they did not "produce", for lack of a better word, at the level that we would normally think of.) Most of those people did not want to leave, though many many did. Denmark for example helped thousands escape. Anyway, that was where they were from, who could blame them. most figured that it would blow over and their rights would be restored or that something would happen. No one expected the "Final Solution" of mass extermination that occurred later in the war. NOBODY. Any indication of that is totally false and completely unfair. It is some of why they are so proactive in protecting the Jewish state and standing up for Jewish "issues." They have a slogan "Never Again" meaning that tragedies like WWII will never happen again due to their inaction and lack of knowlege, which is essentially what happened.

[Adam D]

Just like the Palestinians and other marginalized groups, they didn't want to leave because it was their homeland, and they justly felt they deserved to stay.

[Edwin Watson]

Originally Posted by Adam D

Just like the Palestinians and other marginalized groups, they didn't want to leave because it was their homeland, and they justly felt they deserved to stay.

right, but they did not expect the ovens or the gas chambers. the article indicates that the zionist groups knowingly allowed millions to be executed which is total crap.

[bushsucks]

Originally Posted by Edwin Watson

right, but they did not expect the ovens or the gas chambers. the article indicates that the zionist groups knowingly allowed millions to be executed which is total crap.

In 1944, at the time of the Hungarian deportations, a similar offer was made, whereby all Hungarian Jewry could be saved. The same Zionist hierarchy again refused this offer (after the gas chambers had already taken a toll of millions).



right, right, they never knew.


so when the zionist leaders said, and i quote, and you can find the quote, if you do research.


they said that the jews, their people must submit to suffering and death, more so then the allies, so that at the end of the war, there could be a jewish homeland.


let me make it a little more clear.

a rabbi in hungary, wrote letters telling the jewish leadership about the killings and such, and they never did anything about it, didn't try to save them, didn't try to tell the u.s.

and of course this is fact, look it up for yourself.

[bushsucks]

Originally Posted by PatMeetsPsy

this is intruiging. but is it true?

In 1914, Chaim Weizmann attempted to lay down the foundations of realizing Zionism, and began by asserting that Palestine was empty and that its current inhabitants have no say in its fate. He stated:

"In its initial stage, Zionism was conceived by its pioneers as a movement wholly depending on mechanical factors: there is a country which happens to be called Palestine, a country without people, and, on the other hand, there exists the Jewish people, and it has no country. What else is necessary, then, than to fit the gem into the ring, to unite this people with this country? The owners of the country [the Ottoman Turks] must, there for, be persuaded and conceived that this marriage is advantageous, not only for the [Jewish] people and for the country, but also for themselves." (Expulsion Of The Palestinians, p. 6)

Note how Weizmann didn't claim that the country was empty (see the quote below), but he denied that there was a people which deserved the right of self-determination. The selective definition of "who are a people, and who are not" was crafted to serve Zionists' agenda for the following reasons:

• To lure European Jewry to immigrate to Palestine,
• To secure international legitimacy for the emerging "Jewish state", and
• To deceive the Yishuv, the Jews who were residing in Palestine before 1948, into believing that they were robbing no other people's rights.

Repeatedly, Zionists argued that Palestinians could be "transferred" to neighboring Arab states without infringing their right, and such "transfer" would be beneficial to both communities. Click here if you wish to read our response to this argument.

Just prior to the British conquest of Palestine, Chaim Weizmann wrote describing the Palestinian people as:

" the rocks of Judea, as obstacles that had to be cleared on a difficult path." (Expulsion Of The Palestinians, p. 17)

Note how Weizmann referred to the Palestinian people, as rocks. Usually Zionists use similar dehumanizing language to refer to the Palestinian people, such as rocks, primitive, naive, ignorant, savage, demographic problem, ticking time bombs, question, 5th column, obstacles, "transfer solution", " should be cleared", "should be broomed", etc.

Zionist leaders stressed the strategic advantages to Britain of a "Jewish state" in Palestine. In a letter written in 1914 to a sympathizer, Chaim Weizmann said:

"... should Palestine fall within the British sphere of influence, and should Britain encourage a Jewish settlement there, as a British dependency, we could have in 20 to 30 years a million Jews out there - perhaps more; they would ... form a very effective guard for the Suez Canal." (UN: The Origins And Evolution Of Palestine Problem, section II)

Another Weizmann letter of 1916 reads:

"... The British Cabinet is not only sympathetic toward the Palestinian aspirations of the Jews, but would like to see these aspirations realized ...

England ... would have in the Jews the best possible friends, who would be the best national interpreters of ideas in the eastern countries and would serve as a bridge between the two civilizations. That again is not a material argument, but certainly it ought to carry great weight with any politician who likes to look 50 years ahead." (UN: The Origins And Evolution Of Palestine Problem, section II)

Ironically, the disadvantages of establishing a "Jewish state" are never discussed. For example,

• What if Arabs and Muslims perceive the creation of a "Jewish state" as the 2nd Crusade? What is the impact of this perception on America's and England's national interests?
• What if England's and America's national interests run contrary to the "Jewish state's" national interests? Would Israel point its bayonets against the American and British peoples? It should be noted that Zionist bayonets in Palestine were pointed toward the British (who practically created the "Jewish state") during WWII until May 1948.

Soon after the arrival of Weizmann to Jerusalem in late 1918, he described the ultra-orthodox neighborhoods of the city to his wife as follows:

"There's nothing more humiliating than 'our' Jerusalem. Anything that could be done to desecrate and defile the sacred has been done. It is impossible to imagine so much falsehood, blasphemy, greed, so many lies. It's such an accursed city, there's nothing there, no creature comforts. . . [It] hasn't a single clean and comfortable apartment." (One Palestine Complete, p. 71)

In 1918 Chaim Weizmann denied the existence of an Arab nation in Palestine and portrayed them as ignorant and naive. He described Palestinians in a letter to a colleague of his:

"The poor ignorant fellah [Arabic for peasant] does not worry about politics, but when he is told repeatedly by people in whom he has confidence that his livelihood is in danger of being taken away from him by us, he becomes our mortal enemy. . . The Arab is primitive and believes what he is told." (One Palestine Complete, p. 109)

While the peace conference was convening at Versailles in early 1919, Weizmann was asked of his understanding of the "national home" referred to by Balfour Declaration, he answered:

"the country [Palestine] should be Jewish in the same way that France is French and Britain is British." (One Palestine Complete, p. 117)

Similarly, Weizmann pronounced the same formula in an address to the English Zionist Federation on September 19, 1919:

"By a Jewish National Home I mean the creation of such conditions that as the country is developed we can pour in a considerable number of immigrants, and finally establish such a society in Palestine that Palestine shall be as Jewish as England is English or America American." (Expulsion Of The Palestinians, p. 41)

Even in the early 1920s, the Zionists goals were not popular among many Jewish comminutes around the world. However, the Zionist Organization, with Weizmann's leadership, was a able to erect a powerful lobbying facade in England and the United States as if they were speaking on behalf of all Jews, and in that regard Chaim Weizmann stated:

"The Balfour Declaration of 1917 was built on air ... every day and every hour of these last 10 years, when opening the newspapers, I thought: Whence will the next blow come? I trembled lest the British Government would call me and ask: 'Tell us, what is this Zionist Organization? Where are they, your Zionists?' ... The Jews, they knew, were against us [the Zionists]; we stood alone on a little island, a tiny group of Jews with a foreign past." (UN: The Origins And Evolution Of Palestine Problem, section V)

On the other hand, the holocaust propelled the Zionist Organization, the Jewish Agency, and later the "Jewish state" to become the representative of Jewish interests among most Jews, especially in the United States. For example, the Jewish Agency and the "Jewish state" took the leading role in securing compensation for German atrocities and for Swiss' looting of Jewish artwork.

In the early 1920s, Ben-Gurion asked Chaim Weizmann why he had accepted the promise of a "national home" in Palestine (as referred to by Balfour Declaration) rather than holding out for a state, Weizmann responded the he did not demand a state because he would not have gotten one. For him the choice of "national home" was a "tactical question". Weizmann believed in cautious, gradual action, in a doctrine of stages. (One Palestine Complete, p. 101)

[bushsucks]

Originally Posted by PatMeetsPsy

this is intruiging. but is it true?

Thus, the Zionist policy during the Holocaust is best summed up in the words of Greenbaum speaking on 'The Diaspora and the Redemption' at a Tel Aviv meeting in Palestine during February 1943:

For the rescue of the Jews in the Diaspora, we should consolidate our excess strength and the surplus of powers that we have. When they come to us with two plans - the rescue of the masses of Jews in Europe or the redemption of the land - I vote, without a second thought, for the redemption of the land. The more said about the slaughter of our people, the greater the minimization of our efforts to strengthen and promote the Hebraization of the land. If there would be a possibility today of buying packages of food with the money of the 'Keren Hayesod' (United Jewish Appeal) to send it through Lisbon, would we do such a thing? No! And once again No!"

This Greenbaum confirmed after the war:

When they asked me, couldn't you give money out of the United Jewish Appeal funds for the rescue of Jews in Europe, I said, 'NO!' and I say again 'NO!' . . . one should resist this wave which pushes the Zionist activities to secondary importance."

Here we have proof that the establishment of Zionist state in Palestine was the most important priority of the Zionists - not saving the Jews of Europe from extermination. As Rabbi Moshe Shonfeld, in his book The Holocaust Victims Accuse (1977) commented:

The rescue committee of the Jewish Agency falsely bore the name 'rescue'. It would be more appropriate to call it the Committee for Covering Up, Ignoring and Silencing . . . the thoughts of Zionist officials and especially the chairman, Greenbaum, were steeped in plots and schemes to use the holocaust and its consequences to build up the national home and to realize the demands for establishing a Jewish State.

Rabbi Shonfeld noted that other Zionist leaders saw "the shedding of Jewish blood in the Diaspora" as being "necessary in order for us to demand the establishment of a 'Jewish' state" in Palestine. The fate of the Jews of Czechoslovakia was similar to those in Hungary under Kasztner. Money was sent to save a group of Zionist 'chalutzim' (pioneers), while the remainder of the Czech Jews "must resign itself to annihilation in the Auschwitz crematoria." This was effectively the view put forward by Nathan Schwalb, the representative of the Jewish Agency in Switzerland, to the Rescue Committee for Czech Jewry also said:

Since we have the opportunity of this courier, we are writing to the group that they must always remember that matter which is the most important, which is the main issue that must always be before our eyes. After all, the allies will be victorious. After the victory, they will once again divide up the world between the nations as they did at the end of first war. Then they opened the way for us for the first step and now, as the war ends, we must do everything so that Eretz Yisroel should become a Jewish state. Important steps have already been taken in this matter. As to the cry that comes from your country, we must be aware that all the nations of the Allies are spilling much blood and if we do not bring sacrifices, with what will we achieve the right to sit at the table when they make the distribution of nations and territories after the war? And so it would be foolish and impertinent on our side to ask the nations whose blood is being spilled in order to protect our own blood. Because 'rak b'dam tihyu lanu haaretz' (only through blood will the land be ours). As to yourselves - members of the group - you will get out, and for this purpose we are providing you with funds by this courier.

The Zionist leadership not only kept quiet about the news of the holocaust, they actively suppressed it. During his libel trial in Israel after the war, the alleged Nazi collaborator Rudolf Kasztner excused his own silence about the death camps by telling an Israeli Court that other Jewish Agency representatives suppressed the news of the holocaust. Kasztner claimed that he learned later that representatives of the Jewish Agency and Joint Distribution Committee in Switzerland did not give out information to the world press about the extermination of the Jews. Kasztner says he sent cables Istanbul Rescue Committee (of the Jewish Agency), which he also found out were kept secret from the press. The writer Ben Hecht quotes Kasztner as telling an the Israeli court:

I informed them almost daily by cables about the pace of the extermination. My cables were never published anywhere."(Hecht, Ben: Perfidy, Julian Messner, New York, USA, 1961, p.91).

[bushsucks]

Originally Posted by Edwin Watson

right, but they did not expect the ovens or the gas chambers. the article indicates that the zionist groups knowingly allowed millions to be executed which is total crap.

really?

Rabbi Weissmandel may not have known, but the whole world knew of Hitler's plan for the extermination of the Jews, Roma and Slavic peoples, after a formal Allied declaration about the Nazi "Final Solution" in December 1942.

[bushsucks]

and, in there own words, i think you can get the jist.

This was indicated by the Zionist leader Yitzhak Greenbaum, who said in a speech in Tel Aviv, Palestine, on February 18th, 1943 that 'One should resist this wave to push Zionist activities to secondary importance'. He also said 'One cow in Palestine is more important than all the European Jews'. The motto of the Zionists was Rak B'Dam (Only by blood will we get the land).

[bushsucks]

No one expected the "Final Solution" of mass extermination that occurred later in the war. NOBODY. Any indication of that is totally false and completely unfair.

from edwin

Rabbi Weissmandel may not have known, but the whole world knew of Hitler's plan for the extermination of the Jews, Roma and Slavic peoples, after a formal Allied declaration about the Nazi "Final Solution" in December 1942.

He asserts that 'between 1938 and 1942 there were few [newspapers] that had not mentioned that the aim of the Nazis was to put an end to Jewish life in all the lands to which Nazi conquests would extend'.16 Sharf also implies that between 1942 and 1944 there was a large number of articles on the extermination of the Jews.17 And he shows that there was widespread coverage by the press of the 'blood for trucks' proposal in July 1944, when the Nazis attempted to barter the remaining Jews of Hungary for thousands of trucks and other goods.18

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache...er+1942.&hl=en

A remarkable chapter in Unity in Dispersion is the one that deals with the 'Rescue Attempts': "From September, 1939 until June 29, 1942, the Jews were the forgotten men of the democratic world" (p. 160).

There was almost no information on the fate of East European Jewry. A first attempt to break this silence was made during the St. James Conference in London in January 1942, when eight exile governments and the National Committee of 'Free France' convened for a "discussion on German war crimes."

‘On January 13, 1942, the Conference issued a declaration branding the reign of terror instituted by Germany in occupied countries, the mass expulsions, the execution of hostages, and the massacres. Not one reference was made to the crimes against the Jews’ (p. 160).

‘On February 18 the Congress made formal representations on this subject to the Conference, asking for a specific statement with reference to the "many and special crimes against the Jews." It was not until almost three months later that General Wladyslaw Sikorski, President of the Conference, finally replied that a specific reference to the sufferings endured by the Jews "might be equivalent to an implicit recognition of the racial theories which we all reject"’ (pp. 161, 261-262).

Thereupon the British section of the WJC organized on 29 June 1942 its own 'Conference of the Press of the Free World,' where the "Facts of a Systematic Extermination of European Jewry" were announced. What "facts" these were is not revealed in the conference minutes. One is therefore forced to rely on a number of general press reports that cannot be checked out and are lacking documentary value. There were, however, immediate reactions in Britain and abroad. The British Broadcasting Corporation transmitted – for the first time – pertaining news, and there were mass demonstrations in the US, which addressed war crimes and the rescue of European Jewry. It was to one of these meetings (Madison Square Gardens, 21 July 1942) that British Prime Minister Winston Churchill sent the following message:

‘The Jews were Hitler's first victims, and ever since they have been in the forefront of resistance to Nazi aggression’ (p.161).

The WJC commented that "This sentence rightly characterized the Jews of whatever nationality as an allied people of the United Nations" (p. 240).

At the World Jewish Congress in NYC, the then President of this congress, Dr. Chaim Weizmann, stated on 3 December 1942:

‘We are not denying and are not afraid to confess that this war is our war and that it is waged for the liberation of Jewry... Stronger than all fronts together is our front, that of Jewry. We are not only giving this war our financial support on which the entire war production is based, we are not only providing our full propaganda power which is the moral energy that keeps this war going. The guarantee of victory is predominantly based on weakening the enemy forces, on destroying them in their own country, within the resistance. And we are the Trojan horses in the enemy's fortress. Thousands of Jews living in Europe constitute the principal factor in the destruction of our enemy. There, our front is a fact and the most valuable aid for victory.’2

In its official document, the WJC neither mentioned any details on the speeches and resolutions of the December 1942 meeting, nor on the meeting as such. However, it can be proven from press reports that the meeting did take place, and Chaim Weizman's speech has been confirmed in its content by an array of facts. Obviously, we are facing here a clear example showing that the present documentation does not contain all the necessary details that are required for historical research to give us an objective judgment of events. It remains as a presentation on Jewry as seen by Jews. It must therefore be supplemented by other documents, including the American government's diplomatic papers.

But even this would not suffice. Dr. Nahum Goldmann refers to other connections:

‘This weakness of the President frequently results in failure on the part of the White House to report all the facts to the Senate and the Congress; its description of the prevailing situation is not always absolutely correct and in conformity with the truth...

‘When I lived in America, I learned that Jewish personalities – most of them rich donors for the parties – had easy access to the President. They used to contact him over the head of the Foreign Secretary and the representative at the United Nations and other officials. They were often in a position to alter the entire political line by a single telephone conversation...

‘Stephen Wise... occupied a unique position not only within American Jewry, but also generally in America.... He was a close friend of Wilson... he was also an intimate friend of Roosevelt and had permanent access to him, a factor which naturally affected his relations to other members of the American Administration....

‘The President's car stopped in front of the verandah, and before we could exchange greetings, Roosevelt remarked: "How interesting! Sam Rosenman, Stephen Wise and Nahum Goldmann are sitting there discussing what order they should give to the President of the United States. Just imagine what amount of money the Nazis would pay to obtain a photo of this scene." ‘We began to stammer to the effect that there was an urgent message from Europe to be discussed by us, which Rosenman would submit to him on Monday. Roosevelt dismissed him with the words: "This is quite all right. On Monday I shall hear from Sam what I have to do," and he drove on.’3

This should only be understood as an example that is off the record, but may nevertheless be of paramount significance.

Nor is it unimportant to know that Samuel Untermeyer, who called for a "holy war" against Germany in 1933,

‘was so close to Roosevelt that his nephew Lawrence Steinhardt became the new US ambassador in Moscow in the fall of 1938, succeeding the President's friend Joseph Davis. It is customary in American politics, that only the closest friends of the President are normally entrusted with jobs of this importance.’4

Equally important, but not mentioned in the diplomatic papers, is certainly the creation of a 'World Anti-Nazi Council to Fight for Human Rights.' It was founded in 1936 by Samuel Untermeyer together with the British unionist, Sir Walter Critine, to serve as an Agent for "psychological warfare" and – concealed from the public – to be financed by the Jewish Defense Fund. Winston Churchill became one of its activists. And the ideas of the American President F. D. Roosevelt – years before the actual commencement of the war! – about a sea blockade and "quarantine" against "the Dictators" (directed however only against Germany and Japan) in collaboration with Britain which would have to be pressured for this purpose, exposed the world-political dimensions of the engagement of "pressure groups." Also the catchword of the "rejected coexistence" had been assumed by FDR years before the war.4

http://www.heretical.com/walendy/wjc-fdr.html

need more?

[Edwin Watson]

while it is true that knowlege of a program termed "the Final Soulution" had reached the west by the end of 1942, it was viewed in terms of a pogrom (or a riot against the Jews) but not as the system of mass extermination that it actually was. Even with the occasional reports of what was happening, sadly, the governments of the Allied nations, in addition to the citizens of those countries, could not concieve of the slaughter of millions and thought that the reports were greatly exaggerated. The Zionists saw this in much the same way, though there was admittedly a battle raging within the Zionist movement.

The Zionists had split into two camps. Neither believed the wholesale slaughter of the Jews was really happening, though they did have reports of it, they thought it was most likely exaggerated. One side wanted to spend the money set aside to buy land in palestine on paying the Nazi ransoms of many of the European Jews, the others did not. thinking that the reports were exaggerated or a plan to distract from the ultimate goal of establishing a Jewish state, they chose not to gamble and chose to keep spending their money purchasing the land in palestine. We all know now that they gambled wrong and that the governments in the west were horribly wrong in their underestimation of the horrors of the Final Solution.

The fact is that noone could concieve of such a thing actually happening. It was too horrible to believe. Keeping this in mind, we come to the Blood for Trucks and the later offers to release Jews from Hungary and Czechoslovakia. The trade was 100,000 Jews for 10,000 trucks for use on the eastern front. The war in Europe was beginning to wind down, the Nazi's were running out of equiptment and had already killed something in the millions of russians. Keeping in mind the underestimation of the final solution, the judgement was made that giving the Nazi's 10,000 more trucks would prolong the war, lead to hundreds of thousands and possibly millions more deaths, more money, AND destroy any chance at a further alliance with the Soviets or some sort of amicable relationship at the end of the war, something that would most likely lead to further conflict and millions of more deaths. They saw it a too big a risk to take.

here is an interesting article - http://eprints.unimelb.edu.au/archiv...astfinaliv.doc


incidentally, many of the things you seem to be quoting or pulling a reference from I could only find on NAZI websites and on other Conspiracy websites that talk of things such as the illuminati, etc. which destroys any credibility for those comments in my eyes.

Anyway, above is what happened according to conventional history. if you choose to buy into the history put forth by Nazi revisionists and some conspiracy theorists website, that is your choice.

Oh, and please quit copy and pasting stuff from a conspiracy site, purporting it as your own reseach and the telling me that i can find the quotes if I do the research. why dont you find the original sources and let me know where they are like i do for you. half the quotes you use can only be found on these sites and many belong to people or organizations that dont exist.

John Yesteryear of the "Conspiracy Theorists Make Shit Up Organization" has been quoted as saying, "Conspiracy Theorists Make Shit Up!"

[bushsucks]

Neither believed the wholesale slaughter of the Jews was really happening, though they did have reports of it, they thought it was most likely exaggerated.

When they come to us with two plans - the rescue of the masses of Jews in Europe or the redemption of the land - I vote, without a second thought, for the redemption of the land.


they thought it most likely false?

or they didn't care?

The fact is that noone could concieve of such a thing actually happening. It was too horrible to believe.

The more said about the slaughter of our people, the greater the minimization of our efforts to strengthen and promote the Hebraization of the land.

Then they opened the way for us for the first step and now, as the war ends, we must do everything so that Eretz Yisroel should become a Jewish state. Important steps have already been taken in this matter. As to the cry that comes from your country, we must be aware that all the nations of the Allies are spilling much blood and if we do not bring sacrifices, with what will we achieve the right to sit at the table when they make the distribution of nations and territories after the war? And so it would be foolish and impertinent on our side to ask the nations whose blood is being spilled in order to protect our own blood. Because 'rak b'dam tihyu lanu haaretz' (only through blood will the land be ours

During his libel trial in Israel after the war, the alleged Nazi collaborator Rudolf Kasztner excused his own silence about the death camps by telling an Israeli Court that other Jewish Agency representatives suppressed the news of the holocaust


sadly edwin, their own words prove you wrong.

even, and i stress even if they thought the reports were false, which they knew they were not, it would not of mattered.

resist this wave which pushes zionist activitys to secondery importance.

one cow in palestine is worth all the jews in europe

must bring sacrifices to the table(no not goats and lambs)

only thru blood will the land be ours( now does this sound like the motto of people tring to stop bloodshed?)

incidentally, many of the things you seem to be quoting or pulling a reference from I could only find on NAZI websites and on other Conspiracy websites that talk of things such as the illuminati, etc. which destroys any credibility for those comments in my eyes.

you mean this site?

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache...er+1942.&hl=en


from the university of melb?

yeah i always thought those guys were nazi's.

hey want do you know, you visted that same site, and shot me back my own link, now thats smart, thanks for taking the time to look at mine, call them conspriacy sites, and then recommend them to me.

here is an interesting article - http://eprints.unimelb.edu.au/archi...Mastfinaliv.doc

this paper btw talks about the british press during the war, and not much else, already read it before you offered it, but thanks anyway.

http://www.heretical.com/walendy/wjc-fdr.html

now i can see how this would make you think untrue

In order to emphasize the documentary character of this publication, we left largely without commentary our examination of the very important document on the World Jewish Congress (WJC) Unity in Dispersion, a History of the WJC, published in New York in 1948.

you see most of the things on the site i just quoted and you never read, is footnoted to the unity in dispersion book.


or lets just get to the facts, which quote saying fuck the jews long live the homeland dont you believe?and need more proof of?

[bushsucks]

Originally Posted by bushsucks

When they come to us with two plans - the rescue of the masses of Jews in Europe or the redemption of the land - I vote, without a second thought, for the redemption of the land.


they thought it most likely false?

or they didn't care?




The more said about the slaughter of our people, the greater the minimization of our efforts to strengthen and promote the Hebraization of the land.

Then they opened the way for us for the first step and now, as the war ends, we must do everything so that Eretz Yisroel should become a Jewish state. Important steps have already been taken in this matter. As to the cry that comes from your country, we must be aware that all the nations of the Allies are spilling much blood and if we do not bring sacrifices, with what will we achieve the right to sit at the table when they make the distribution of nations and territories after the war? And so it would be foolish and impertinent on our side to ask the nations whose blood is being spilled in order to protect our own blood. Because 'rak b'dam tihyu lanu haaretz' (only through blood will the land be ours

During his libel trial in Israel after the war, the alleged Nazi collaborator Rudolf Kasztner excused his own silence about the death camps by telling an Israeli Court that other Jewish Agency representatives suppressed the news of the holocaust


sadly edwin, their own words prove you wrong.

even, and i stress even if they thought the reports were false, which they knew they were not, it would not of mattered.

resist this wave which pushes zionist activitys to secondery importance.

one cow in palestine is worth all the jews in europe

must bring sacrifices to the table(no not goats and lambs)

only thru blood will the land be ours( now does this sound like the motto of people tring to stop bloodshed?)



you mean this site?

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache...er+1942.&hl=en


from the university of melb?

yeah i always thought those guys were nazi's.

hey want do you know, you visted that same site, and shot me back my own link, now thats smart, thanks for taking the time to look at mine, call them conspriacy sites, and then recommend them to me.


this paper btw talks about the british press during the war, and not much else, already read it before you offered it, but thanks anyway.


now i can see how this would make you think untrue


you see most of the things on the site i just quoted and you never read, is footnoted to the unity in dispersion book.


or lets just get to the facts, which quote saying fuck the jews long live the homeland dont you believe?and need more proof of?

no anwsers yet?

[bushsucks]

I am an orthodox Jew who is opposed to Zionism. Tahya Dawlat Filasteen.

I am shocked and horrified at the latest allegations of mutilation and desecration of
murdered Palestinian civilians at the hands of the Zionist occupation forces. No human possessed of a modicum of moral character could possibly condone the criminal actions perpetrated by the Zionists, least of all authentic Jews.

If you have not had the opportunity to do so, may I suggest you visit the following web sites which lay out the authentic Jewish position, based on the Torah and Prophets and Sages, concerning Palestine. These sites include www.netureikarta.org, www.nkusa.org, www.jewsagainstzionism.com, and www.jewsnotzionists.org.

These sites will explain to you how abhorrent and abominable the Zionist Reich is in the eyes of orthodox Jews who have not been tainted and seduced by the Zionist apostasy. For believing Jews, Zionism is anathema to our religion, indeed to our very being. Real Jews do not want to take over Palestine. Real Jews wish to live in peace with all peoples, especially our Arab/Muslim cousins. Real Jews commiserate with the suffering of the Palestinian people at the hands of the satanic Zionist Reich. Real Jews call upon the UN to dismantle the Zionist Reich and correct its fateful and tragic error made some 54 years ago in which it legitimized the rape and colonization of Palestine by the Zionists, who, as far as we are concerned, are not Jews at all but rather heretics (kufr) and the reincarnation of 'Amalek, the Biblical arch nemesis of the Jewish people.

We entreat G-d thrice daily to bring an end to the dominion of the heretical Zionist Reich and to restore all of historic Palestine to its rightful owners, the Palestinians, in accordance with His divine will.


We yet hope for the restoration of amicable relations between Arabs/Muslims and Jews as was the case in the past. The dissolution of the Zionist Reich will enable all mankind to live in peace and security.


Tahya Dawlat Filasteen.

Sincerely,

Adiv Abramson
z2v8yp@worldnet.att.net


http://www.informationclearinghouse....rticle1637.htm