Bush to relax protected species rules

[GreyArea]

WASHINGTON - The Bush administration on Monday said it plans to let federal agencies decide for themselves whether highways, dams, mines and other construction projects might harm endangered animals and plants.The proposal, which does not require the approval of Congress, would reduce the mandatory, independent reviews that government scientists have been performing for 35 years. Developers welcomed the plan, while environmentalists derided it.
Interior Secretary Dirk Kempthorne said late Monday the changes were needed to ensure that the Endangered Species Act would not be used as a “back door” to regulate the gases blamed for global warming.

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[charlie brown]

lol how dare they use an already existing law to regulate an already existing problem!

[GreyArea]

Originally Posted by matias

lol how dare they use an already existing law to regulate an already existing problem!

nice reading skills there champ

[charlie brown]

Interior Secretary Dirk Kempthorne said late Monday the changes were needed to ensure that the Endangered Species Act would not be used as a “back door” to regulate the gases blamed for global warming.

did I misunderstand this?

[C-fer]

Originally Posted by matias

did I misunderstand this?

Flew over my head. What does that sentence mean?

[GreyArea]

Originally Posted by matias

did I misunderstand this?

I think you didn't read the entire article.

How is removing scientific review a good thing?

Under current law, federal agencies must consult with experts at the Fish and Wildlife Service or the National Marine Fisheries Service to determine whether a project is likely to jeopardize any endangered species or to damage habitat, even if no harm seems likely. ... The Interior Department said such consultations are no longer necessary because federal agencies have developed expertise to review their own construction and development projects, according to the 30-page draft obtained by the AP.

[charlie brown]

I was being sarcastic and mocking the interior secretary for basically admitting that the endangered species act could be used to regulate development with global warming in mind

[umalak_]

i'm sure this is not as bad as you think it is

give xian a chance to look it over and he'll come up with a way that this improves life

[I AM EL-NINO]

Originally Posted by matias

I was being sarcastic and mocking the interior secretary for basically admitting that the endangered species act could be used to regulate development with global warming in mind

<shakes head>
Global warming??

[PETA]

Originally Posted by I AM EL-NINO

<shakes head>
Global warming??

yeah, weren't you aware?

If we don't shut down our economy New York will be under water some time between next week and 2012 at the latest.

[charlie brown]

oh come on fellas - global warming is now being recognized by pretty much all scientists around the globe

[PETA]

Originally Posted by matias

oh come on fellas - global warming is now being recognized by pretty much all scientists around the globe

sure has... 1 degree in the last 100 years.

what isn;t recognized is how much is due to human activity and what amount of reduction in our activity will have what effect in what time frame and whether or not that is a a wise thing to do.... so, pretty much every question other than... did the temp go up is not recognized and settled.

what is harmful to the debate is Al Gore. When he shows pictures of NYC under water do you think that alarmist idiocy helps foster an environment for the free exchange of ideas or do you think it gets people like me thinking most global warming advocates are a bunch of tin foil hat nut cases?

The UN report on Global Warming pretty much refuted the bulk of Gore's exaggeratd claims. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_Inco...ruth#Criticism

A March 13, 2007 article in The New York Times reported on concerns among some scientists about the tone and the accuracy of the film, noting that they "argue that some of Mr. Gore’s central points are exaggerated and erroneous." Gore's discussion of a rise in sea level of up to 20 feet, while not stating a timeframe, appears in contrast with a report from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), which predicts a maximum rise of 23 inches this century, excluding non-linear effects on ice sheets

I'm all about reducing emissions, pollution is a shitty thing. I'm not about destroying our economy while India, China, Pakistan and Indonesia continue pouring pollutants into the atmosphere ... blah blah blah

[charlie brown]

al gore is a buffoon - no need to even take him into account to consider global warming an issue or not

and the thing is that 4 wrongs don't make a right. just because other nations are not helping does not mean that we shouldn't.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by matias

and the thing is that 4 wrongs don't make a right. just because other nations are not helping does not mean that we shouldn't.

yes it does

there is no proof drastic measures will have any impact and if they do how much and when they'll take place nor that the increased production from non-compliant states won't offset our reductions. With that degree of uncertainty I think its silly to take steps that could well endanger an already troubled economy.

Like I said, I'm cool on reducing emissions and conrtolling pollution - that's a duty imo we owe future generations. But I'm not about mesures that'll tear down the economy. Handing our children a future in the poorhouse isn't a good idea either.

Go nuke ffs if we really want to curb CO2 emissions. But that's not what huge numbers of the global warming crowd want to hear - they're just anti-capitalist, anti-west fucking leftist global citizens with more time than good ideas.

[tricky]

Originally Posted by xian

I'm all about reducing emissions, pollution is a shitty thing. I'm not about destroying our economy while India, China, Pakistan and Indonesia continue pouring pollutants into the atmosphere ... blah blah blah

Might you consider the shitload of other problems destroying our economy besides "omg, we're gonna be regulating pollution!!" Quit being so simpleminded.

Thought about how China/India are pumping out more science/math majors than ever before. ...How few Americans are actually pursuing these fields and the majority of college graduates are still fucking idiots because the education system is a disaster while everyone is highfiving eachother about no child left behind and teaching to the test so the kids learn nothing else. Meanwhile, students are indebted to giant corporations with their loans and college tuition is skyrocketing... Pollution control is an easy target...but come on xian.