Shocking Video Unearthed Dems fighting, covering up Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac crisis

[PETA]

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

the loans are a problem but the real issue is the lack of liquidity in the commercial paper market and the fact that there is trillions in cdf swaps that was pure speculation and when companies don't hedge properly they loose everything and owe more than they have, it's a chain brought down by the weakest links. I understand that you want to blame clinton but this issue is far beyond anyone cause. I could really give a shit who let these assholes fuck up everything but I say we get shit straight then just do a serious third party inquiry and anything illegal should have the library thrown at them and their children.

I didn't blame Clinton exclusively - please refer to the laundry list I gave you. I'd put him Reno and their policies high on the list (Barney Frank too) but the credit agencies and Greenspan's weak dollar belong on it as well (and that's not a complete list - just my current opinion of the list toppers - I learn more every day and get no less disgusted). As far as review - of course - I think everyone agrees that there needs to be some very serious inquiry to determine if the law was broken and if so thumb tack their ears to a board.

[PETA]

Alec Baldwin blames Clinton and Frank?

Baldwin: Dems Caused Financial Meltdown

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[BigBallinColin]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

Alec Baldwin blames Clinton and Frank?

Baldwin: Dems Caused Financial Meltdown

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lol, if you think alec baldwin is going to convince me of anything other than he needs to do more narration work for good movies, you are sorely mistaken.


your are right that those loans weren't the best but they didn't tell the banks that they had to screw people that didn't know what they could afford. The loans are really not near the problem that cds and people breaking the dollar on the commercial paper market. if that was going right the loans wouldn't be a problem. I mean the cds "exchange" is like 60 trillon, it's completely unregulated and is mostly pure spectulation.

[ManWithNoName]

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

lol, if you think alec baldwin is going to convince me of anything other than he needs to do more narration work for good movies, you are sorely mistaken.


your are right that those loans weren't the best but they didn't tell the banks that they had to screw people that didn't know what they could afford. The loans are really not near the problem that cds and people breaking the dollar on the commercial paper market. if that was going right the loans wouldn't be a problem. I mean the cds "exchange" is like 60 trillon, it's completely unregulated and is mostly pure spectulation.

The truth is self-evident. If you cannot accept this then you must be delusional. I encourage you to stop drinking the mass media kool-aid and accept the facts from a man who in 2004 said he would move out of US if Bush were elected. Listen to what he is saying now - for you're own good.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

lol, if you think alec baldwin is going to convince me of anything other than he needs to do more narration work for good movies, you are sorely mistaken.

You think he's full of shit? FTR - I agree that his endorsement of a position isn't important - makes him no less correct though.

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

your are right that those loans weren't the best but they didn't tell the banks that they had to screw people that didn't know what they could afford. The loans are really not near the problem that cds and people breaking the dollar on the commercial paper market. if that was going right the loans wouldn't be a problem. I mean the cds "exchange" is like 60 trillon, it's completely unregulated and is mostly pure spectulation.

Yes, that is pretty much exactly what Reno told the banks - issue the notes or she's sue them. The loans became a problem because people couldn't afford them not because of "cds" or people "breaking the dollar."

I don't think I know what you mean by cds btw and I'm not terribly confident the 60 minutes is a good source to explain what's going on with this crisis.

[BigBallinColin]

Originally Posted by manwithnoname

the truth is self-evident. If you cannot accept this then you must be delusional. I encourage you to stop drinking the mass media kool-aid and accept the facts from a man who in 2004 said he would move out of us if bush were elected. Listen to what he is saying now - for you're own good.

dude you are miss informed, those loans aren"t that bad. Also a relatively small part of the over all "credit crisis". No one bank has enough trust to lend any one money. I also don"t understand the for my own good comment> is that a threat> what will happen if i don"t listen to alec baldwin< i am about to loose my mind listening to your corny ass. I don"t let people think for me i do it myself. I will decide if i am delusional, and so far i think i am doing okay today. So you actually think that either candidate will actually fix this problem any better than the other one? They are both trying to do the same thing to fix the problem.

edit-I didn't watch the whole thing at first but he blames EVERYBODY!

[BigBallinColin]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

You think he's full of shit? FTR - I agree that his endorsement of a position isn't important - makes him no less correct though.



Yes, that is pretty much exactly what Reno told the banks - issue the notes or she's sue them. The loans became a problem because people couldn't afford them not because of "cds" or people "breaking the dollar."

I don't think I know what you mean by cds btw and I'm not terribly confident the 60 minutes is a good source to explain what's going on with this crisis.

I didnt get the credit default swaps(cds I just got tired of typing that out) from 60 minutes. The loans to people that cannot pay their mortgage is pretty small. the number of actual families is even smaller. there was a lot of real estate speculation in the market as well. So it is not like there are millions of families defaulting on their home loans.

[ManWithNoName]

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

edit-I didn't watch the whole thing at first but he blames EVERYBODY!

Well, can you blame me for thinking you were a bit delusional? lol

Ok, you're not.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

I didnt get the credit default swaps(cds I just got tired of typing that out) from 60 minutes. The loans to people that cannot pay their mortgage is pretty small. the number of actual families is even smaller. there was a lot of real estate speculation in the market as well. So it is not like there are millions of families defaulting on their home loans.

OK - this is the private side mirroring Fannie and Freddie

Bond insurance....

Residential Asset Securitized Trusts buy up notes and bundle them together to spread out risk. The trusts sell bonds on the market based on those bundles. The trusts pay bond holders from the income stream received from the notes. Sufficient number of note defaults makes the bonds miss payments and a trigger event occurs and AIG has to pay out billions.

Hadn't heard the term used before but that was the function - insurance against defualt by the trust to their bond holders resulting from note payer default.

The re speculation problems were largely foreign money. It came pouring into especially the CA and FL markets. The investment money funded loans and bought up bonds. There were shit tons of speculators taking out notes on residential re - lots of flippers - and when the market tanked and they couldn't sell it didn't take long for them to run out of the necessary cash to make their note payments and boom... default.

[BigBallinColin]

Originally Posted by ManWithNoName

Well, can you blame me for thinking you were a bit delusional? lol

Ok, you're not.

I try to not get offended, you candor almost makes me feel bad I was kind of irritated. I know what you are saying, i agree that the good ideal but bad practices was signed by clinton, but parts of the bill were slipped in at the last moment. It was overwhelmingly passed by both sides. I like that people that can actually afford a home can get into one, I think that helps neighborhoods get better. it just needs to be in a smaller scale in combination with state and even city help. I blame everyone, I don't think we can go back and arrest anyone in the government, they didn't break any laws just didn't make the law work right or just a bad law. I do think that there were accounting errors and bullshit fraud running rampant( and by that I mean a few to some companies that were middle weight scumbags) and I think that some independent accounting office should go through there assets and make sure shit is right, if it's fucked they have to be put in pound them in the ass prison and figure out how to turn anal rape in to an alternative energy .

[Dionysos]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

Alec Baldwin blames Clinton and Frank?

Baldwin: Dems Caused Financial Meltdown

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This is one of the things I like about Baldwin and shows he's adept at politics, he realizes the problem is on both sides and isn't afraid to say it.

[BigBallinColin]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

OK - this is the private side mirroring Fannie and Freddie

Bond insurance....
... and when the market tanked and they couldn't sell it didn't take long for them to run out of the necessary cash to make their note payments and boom... default.

exactly there was a lot of crazy shit going around at the same time, to blame one or the other side of the government is useless. lets fix this shit then get any assholes along the way. I really wish some third party with major funding and a centerist pragmatic view would have come out. they would have destroyed.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by BigBallinColin

exactly there was a lot of crazy shit going around at the same time, to blame one or the other side of the government is useless. lets fix this shit then get any assholes along the way. I really wish some third party with major funding and a centerist pragmatic view would have come out. they would have destroyed.

Blaming A B or C doesn't solve anything but it doesn't make it anyless A B and C's fault.

I would have preferred a private solution too but the problem is the massive capital position required to buy up the paper and hold it. Not sure any combination of huge financial entities could do that. If they could, I suspect they would have because I think you're right, there's probably a killing to be made buying it at a discount.