Death Camp Nazi?

[Damnsammit]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7986249.stm

What are your feelings on this? They are deporting an 89 year old man to Germany because he might have been a guard at a Nazi death camp during WW2.

I mean, I can understand wanting to make sure justice is served, but how substantial is the evidence going to be after 60+ years?

Nazi or not, I feel sorry for the old man. He has lived with enough grief if he was responsible, I am sure. Plus, how can they guarantee that he was responsible? Sure he was a Nazi, but who is to say that he killed anyone? We don't hold a whole platoon responsible for a screwed up soldier killing civilians.

[GooBox]

He's not killing people now. They should leave the poor man alone.

[Nyteshade]

The Germans claim to have new evidence and want to put him on trial. It's not just the US involved in the deportation.

I personally don't care how much time has passed when it comes to something of that magnitude. I'm against the idea of putting him on trial because it will accomplish nothing. Not for the Jewish people or for Germany. It's a waste of resources for both the US and Germany and sounds like it's being done as a publicity stunt.

Other than that, they could shove him in an oven for all I care if he is actually guilty.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

I mean, I can understand wanting to make sure justice is served, but how substantial is the evidence going to be after 60+ years?

Substantial enough to warrant sending him to Germany to let a jury decide if he's a criminal or not.

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

Nazi or not, I feel sorry for the old man.

Let's think that one again. How about we rephrase it... "An accomplice in the largest mass murder in human history or not I feel sorry for the old man..."

so... do you really feel sorry for him or are you actually concerned that they may have the wrong guy? Because those are two very distinct issues.

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

He has lived with enough grief if he was responsible, I am sure.

And just how in the world are you sure he lived with not just with grief but with enough grief? How much grief is sufficient for being part of the extermination of 6,000,000 Jews?

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

Plus, how can they guarantee that he was responsible?

By putting him on trial and letting a jury decide.

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

Sure he was a Nazi, but who is to say that he killed anyone? We don't hold a whole platoon responsible for a screwed up soldier killing civilians.

You do when the rest of the platoon stands guard while the fucked up gus kill the civillians.

Originally Posted by GooBox

He's not killing people now. They should leave the poor man alone.

Kinda like OBL right?

If here is enough evidence to warrant trial then arrest him and put the guy on trial and either convict him or don't.

[johnny861]

I dunno... should there be a statute of limitations for being an accomplice to genocide?

[Sinner]

Originally Posted by johnny861

I dunno... should there be a statute of limitations for being an accomplice to genocide?

lol!

[Damnsammit]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

Substantial enough to warrant sending him to Germany to let a jury decide if he's a criminal or not.

Fair enough. I’m interested in seeing how it all unfolds in court.

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

so... do you really feel sorry for him or are you actually concerned that they may have the wrong guy? Because those are two very distinct issues.

I feel sorry for him regardless. A soldier (especially a young one with little to no rank) fighting a war is usually just doing what they are told because they love their country. I don't think every single Nazi was a horrible person or even on board with the ideals that Hitler forced on them.

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

And just how in the world are you sure he lived with not just with grief but with enough grief? How much grief is sufficient for being part of the extermination of 6,000,000 Jews?

I'm not saying this guy is innocent, but it was a war and he probably thought he was going to die unless he followed orders and rightfully so, considering there wasn't much room for insubordination in the Nazi regime. I just find it hard to believe that he hasn’t changed and regretted his actions. I don’t see how anyone with an ounce of humanity could NOT change after the atrocities of WW2.

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

You do when the rest of the platoon stands guard while the fucked up gus kill the civillians.

Well by that accord, every German who passively stood by watching their military kill millions of innocent people should be put on trial. Only the ones that were brave enough to harbor the Jews are safe? Considering he is still alive, and would have been in his early 20’s during the war I doubt he had much of a choice in his actions as his alternative was his own death. I’m not saying it’s justified but would you rather kill or be killed if given the option?

[Nyteshade]

None of that applies to someone who claims to have been a prisoner the entire time.

[Tryptafiend]

If he was a soldier and following orders he isn't responsible for the deaths of anyone. his superior officer or officers are the ones who gave the orders. Or should we convict our own soldiers who are following orders and killing in Iraq.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

I feel sorry for him regardless. A soldier (especially a young one with little to no rank) fighting a war is usually just doing what they are told because they love their country. I don't think every single Nazi was a horrible person or even on board with the ideals that Hitler forced on them.

But you are presuming facts that you don't know to be either true or false to reach that conclusion.

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

I'm not saying this guy is innocent, but it was a war and he probably thought he was going to die unless he followed orders and rightfully so, considering there wasn't much room for insubordination in the Nazi regime. I just find it hard to believe that he hasn’t changed and regretted his actions. I don’t see how anyone with an ounce of humanity could NOT change after the atrocities of WW2.

Originally Posted by Damnsammit

Well by that accord, every German who passively stood by watching their military kill millions of innocent people should be put on trial. Only the ones that were brave enough to harbor the Jews are safe? Considering he is still alive, and would have been in his early 20’s during the war I doubt he had much of a choice in his actions as his alternative was his own death. I’m not saying it’s justified but would you rather kill or be killed if given the option?

speculation based on little in irder to justify sympathy for a man who may be guilty of war crimes.

Originally Posted by Tryptafiend

If he was a soldier and following orders he isn't responsible for the deaths of anyone. his superior officer or officers are the ones who gave the orders. Or should we convict our own soldiers who are following orders and killing in Iraq.

That fundamentally misstates both the history of Nuremberg as well as how the UCMJ works.

"Following orders" is no defense to war crimes. It may mitigate punishment but it does not extinguish guilt.

[Keith P]

Interesting. Don't see much to try him on unless he was banging Charlotte Rampling. Let us know when more info comes out.

[Keith P]

I'm sure Christian has brought up "the just following my orders" defense was used in the Nuremberg trials and found wanting.

[Dionysos]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

That fundamentally misstates both the history of Nuremberg as well as how the UCMJ works.

Don't worry about that so much, Gramps is old and I'm sure really sorry for helping the effort to exterminate a race from the planet. We should all just move on already, it's not like this affected the course of history and indirectly led to the Israel/Palestine conflict and the rise of violent Islamic extremism. Leave Gramps alone, hater.