So yeah, abortion is murder right?

[DJPePe]

So what is this then?

Suspect in Kan. doctor's death warns of violence
AP


Scott Roeder makes his first court appearance via a video link from the AP – Scott Roeder makes his first court appearance via a video link from the Sedgwick County Jail on Tuesday, …


By ROXANA HEGEMAN, Associated Press Writer Roxana Hegeman, Associated Press Writer – Mon Jun 8, 11:45 am ET

WICHITA, Kan. – Abortion providers say that threats of more slayings from a man accused in the shooting death of a high-profile Kansas abortion doctor proves the existence of a "violent, terrorist movement" coalescing around the issue.

Scott Roeder called The Associated Press Sunday from the Sedgwick County jail, where he's being held on charges of first-degree murder and aggravated assault in the shooting death of Dr. George Tiller last week at the doctor's church in Wichita.

"I know there are many other similar events planned around the country as long as abortion remains legal," Roeder said. When asked by the AP if he was referring to another shooting, he refused to elaborate.

It wasn't clear whether Roeder knew of any impending violence or was simply seeking publicity for his cause. Law enforcement authorities, including the Justice Department, said they didn't know whether Sunday's comments were credible. And a leader of the anti-abortion movement derided the accused shooter as "a fruit and a lunatic."

"He is a terrorist — there is no question about that. I don't believe he is an isolated terrorist," said Dr. LeRoy Carhart, a Nebraska abortion provider who also practiced at Tiller's Wichita clinic.

In response to the remarks, Dr. Warren Hern, of Boulder, Colo., called on President Barack Obama to go on national television and demand that anti-abortion violence and terrorism stop.

"It is exactly the same as the Taliban, but the Taliban is 8,000 miles away and the Taliban is too civilized to assassinate people in mosques," said Hern, one of the few remaining doctors in the country who performs late-term abortions.

Carhart acknowledged Roeder might just be trying to get publicity, but noted that Tiller was not the first abortion provider killed.

"There is more than one lunatic running loose in this country that can be influenced by the religious rhetoric," Carhart said.

Asked if he shot Tiller, Roeder said he couldn't comment and needed to clear everything with his lawyer.

Tiller's clinic, one of the few in the country to perform late-term abortions, had been a target of regular demonstrations. Most were peaceful, but his clinic was bombed in 1986 and he was shot in both arms in 1993. In 1991, a 45-day "Summer of Mercy" campaign organized by Operation Rescue drew thousands of abortion opponents to Wichita, and there were more than 2,700 arrests.

Justice Department spokesman Matthew Miller said in a written statement Sunday that "we take this matter seriously, which is why the Attorney General ordered increased protection of appropriate people and facilities last week."

And the Justice Department opened an investigation Friday to see if Tiller's killer had accomplices. The department said its Civil Rights Division and the U.S. attorney's office in Kansas would investigate whether the killing violated a 1994 law creating criminal penalties for violent or damaging conduct toward abortion providers and their patients.

An attorney for the Tiller family, Dan Monnat, said he wasn't sure they should be dignifying Roeder's threats with a response "every time he makes a hare-brained phone call."

"I am hopeful that state and federal authorities, including Homeland Security, will give Mr. Roeder and his information a deserving response," Monnat said, declining to elaborate.

Nancy Keenan president of NARAL-Pro-Choice America, said Roeder's comments "continue to escalate that kind of activity, that kind of violence. Quite honestly, I think it's imperative for anti-choice groups to tone down that rhetoric and keep the more extreme elements in their movement form copying Scott Roeder."

Troy Newman, president of the anti-abortion group Operation Rescue, sent an e-mail to the AP Sunday saying of the man accused of shooting Tiller: "This guy is a fruit and a lunatic."

Roeder, 51, told the AP he refused to talk to investigators after he was arrested a few hours after Tiller's shooting and has made no statements to police since then.

"I just told them I needed to talk to my lawyer," Roeder said.

In two separate calls to AP Sunday, Roeder also complained about the "deplorable conditions in solitary" in Sedgwick County jail.

Sedgwick County Sheriff Robert Hinshaw said that Roeder was receiving appropriate medical treatment.

"It is after all a jail, but a modern state-of-the-art facility with professional staff," Hinshaw said. "While Mr. Roeder may not care for being in the Sedgwick County jail, all of our conditions and policies are designed to provide safety and security for all inmates, staff and public at large."

Roeder said it was freezing in his cell. "I started having a bad cough. I thought I was going to have pneumonia."

He said he called AP because he wanted to publicize the conditions in the jail so that in the future suspects would not have to endure the same conditions. Roeder also said he wanted the public to know he has been denied phone privileges for the past two days, and needed his sleep apnea machine.

Hinshaw disputed that phone privileges had been denied.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_abortion_shooting

[PETA]

abortion is not murder... just often immoral

killing an abortionist who isn't trying to kill you... that's murder.

[vinnie97]

^semantics, all of the above is pretty murderous.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by vinnie97

^semantics, all of the above is pretty murderous.

yeah?

Main Entry: se·man·tic http://www.merriam-webster.com/images/audio.gif Pronunciation: \si-ˈman-tik\ Variant(s): also se·man·ti·cal http://www.merriam-webster.com/images/audio.gif \-ti-kəl\ Function: adjective Etymology: Greek sēmantikos significant, from sēmainein to signify, mean, from sēma sign, token Date: 1894 1 : of or relating to meaning in language
2 : of or relating to semantics


what words means is fairly important if you want to say what you mean

murder = the unlawful killing of a human with malice aforethought. Abortion is legal and done w/out malice.

Abusing and warping words until they've lost meaning is more common on the left but this is a specific issue where the right often falls into the same absurdity.

[vinnie97]

Well, we could semantically apply it favorably to the pro-life stance as well: Partial-birth abortions are fairly heinous and malicious in the inhumane manner in which they are performed, even if they've been deemed legal by a high court.

[PETA]

Originally Posted by vinnie97

Well, we could semantically apply it favorably to the pro-life stance as well:

No. We cannot. As pro-life conservatives (not sure I've ever called myself that before) we're held to a higher standard, to actually say what we mean and mean what we say. Nobody holds liberals to that standard.... like the video from Obama's innauguration speech

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ceb_1232521477

even liberals don't believe (or hope he's lying) what Obama's saying

Originally Posted by vinnie97

Partial-birth abortions are fairly heinous and malicious in the inhumane manner in which they are performed, even if they've been deemed legal by a high court.

malice

Main Entry:
mal·ice http://www.merriam-webster.com/images/audio.gif Pronunciation: \ˈma-ləs\ Function: noun Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French, from Latin malitia, from malus bad Date: 14th century 1 : desire to cause pain, injury, or distress to another
2 : intent to commit an unlawful act or cause harm without legal justification or excuse


Abortionists don't wish to cause pain nor do they intend to break the law... they intend to lawfully kill an unborn baby at the direction of the mother.

..


words count... we need to use them correctly.


Abortion under many circumstances (regardless of whether early or late in the term) shocks the conscience of people who recognize the unborn as innocent humans worthy of our protection. Educating people, giving them the facts, matters. Distorting the the facts corrupts the message. We don't need to hyperbolize.... indeed... how can one given what late term abortion does?

[BradH]

jesus wanted it that way

[PETA]

Originally Posted by BradH

jesus wanted it that way

see... ornery fucking ant eater... geesh

[djredeye]

god says its okay to kill people you dont agree with...as long as its in his house of worship....where he can see it...and ignore the victims pleading his name to not die


and laugh laugh laugh

[johnny861]

A little off topic, but whatever happened to that Californian geneticist who was able to extract embryonic stem cells from a certain type of tumor that could be grown in a lab?

I remember a long time ago reading about this researcher, also a Catholic, presenting his research to the vatican and even getting approval from John Paul II.

It seems like he's all but disappeared.

[Nyteshade]

Originally Posted by johnny861

A little off topic, but whatever happened to that Californian geneticist who was able to extract embryonic stem cells from a certain type of tumor that could be grown in a lab?

I remember a long time ago reading about this researcher, also a Catholic, presenting his research to the vatican and even getting approval from John Paul II.

It seems like he's all but disappeared.

Little to no controversy = lower ratings = not worthy of media attention.

Now let's all see what Britney/Paris/Lindsey did this time, point fingers, and call them names while we pretend that no one on this site has ever done gotten drunk/high and acted inappropriately. Ever.

[vinnie97]

Originally Posted by St. Stalin the Apathetic

No. We cannot. As pro-life conservatives (not sure I've ever called myself that before) we're held to a higher standard, to actually say what we mean and mean what we say. Nobody holds liberals to that standard.... like the video from Obama's innauguration speech

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ceb_1232521477

even liberals don't believe (or hope he's lying) what Obama's saying




malice

Main Entry:
mal·ice http://www.merriam-webster.com/images/audio.gif Pronunciation: \ˈma-ləs\ Function: noun Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French, from Latin malitia, from malus bad Date: 14th century 1 : desire to cause pain, injury, or distress to another
2 : intent to commit an unlawful act or cause harm without legal justification or excuse


Abortionists don't wish to cause pain nor do they intend to break the law... they intend to lawfully kill an unborn baby at the direction of the mother.

..


words count... we need to use them correctly.


Abortion under many circumstances (regardless of whether early or late in the term) shocks the conscience of people who recognize the unborn as innocent humans worthy of our protection. Educating people, giving them the facts, matters. Distorting the the facts corrupts the message. We don't need to hyperbolize.... indeed... how can one given what late term abortion does?

The intention doesn't seem that significant to me when referring to partial-birth especially...the intended inhumane consequences are the same regardless. It just seems like a misplaced priority and an oversight to get hung up on whether the provider was acting with "malice" (and whose to say some don't find delight in "trimming the herd?" only the thought police could make that determination ).

[PETA]

Originally Posted by vinnie97

The intention doesn't seem that significant to me when referring to partial-birth especially...the intended inhumane consequences are the same regardless. It just seems like a misplaced priority and an oversight to get hung up on whether the provider was acting with "malice" (and whose to say some don't find delight in "trimming the herd?" only the thought police could make that determination ).

If one call's a thing something it isn't they've distorted the debate rather than clarified it.

[Dionysos]

And this is a case in point of why most people will debate Christian but ignore vinnie.

[PETA]

are you flirting with me.... or are you still hoping I'll take your cat?